Steve Darling MP: speeches

Speeches

• 16 Jan 2025 · Employment Rights Bill (Twenty First sitting) · Hansard source

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  I am delighted that the hon. Member for Mid Buckinghamshire has had a road to Damascus moment on the need for further consultation on the Bill. I am delighted that the Conservatives believe that consultation is a good thing, unlike my Conservative council colleagues in Torbay. I look forward to the Minister looking kindly on the new clause, which shows that the Conservatives believe in consultation. I would ask that he please grasp this opportunity.

• 16 Jan 2025 · Employment Rights Bill (Twenty First sitting) · Hansard source

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  I beg to move, That the clause be read a Second time. The new clause would ensure that workers in the early stages of an employment dispute, such as a disciplinary or grievance hearing, can be supported by those who are qualified, rather than just by trade union representatives or similar colleagues. It would allow for matters to be brought to a head much sooner and prevent cases from necessarily going to tribunal, which clogs up the tribunal system. I hope the Government will take the new clause in the positive sprit in which we tabled it.

• 16 Jan 2025 · Employment Rights Bill (Twenty First sitting) · Hansard source

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  I echo the thanks to you, Sir Christopher, and the other Chairs who have ably chaired the Committee. I thank the Clerks, Doorkeepers and Hansard , who have reported throughout. I thank colleagues for the good-natured way that the Bill has been debated. This is my first Bill Committee, and I look forward with gusto to my next one. I also thank Laura Green, who has ably supported me throughout the Committee.

• 16 Jan 2025 · Employment Rights Bill (Twenty First sitting) · Hansard source

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  I beg to ask leave to withdraw the motion. Clause, by leave, withdrawn. New Clause 51 Access to employment rights: workers on temporary visas “(1) The Secretary of State must, within six months of this Act being passed, commission an independent report on the extent to which workers on temporary visas are able to assert their rights under employment law. (2) In commissioning the report, the Secretary of State must arrange for the report to meet the requirements set out in subsections (2) to (4). (3) The report must examine the extent to which workers on temporary visas feel unable to assert their employment rights because they are dependent on their employers to sponsor their visas. (4) The report must make recommendations to the Secretary of State about how the Secretary of State can support workers on temporary visas in the assertion of their employment rights. (5) The report must be completed within three months of being commissioned. (6) The Secretary of State must, as soon as is practicable after receipt of the report, publish the report and lay it before both Houses of Parliament. (7) The Secretary of State must, within three months of receipt of the report— (a) respond to the recommendations in the report, and (b) publish the response and lay it before both Houses of Parliament.”— (Chris Law.) Brought up, and read the First time .

• 16 Jan 2025 · Employment Rights Bill (Twenty First sitting) · Hansard source

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  I draw the Committee’s attention to the fact that we are looking at employers that employ over 250 individuals, so the new clause would far from impact smaller businesses. I have grave concerns that the Government believe they have all the time in the world and expect that there will be a second glorious term for the Labour party, come hell or high water. The jury is out on whether a second term for Keir will appear. One is better driving the agenda forward while one has the helm than to hope for the helm when it turns the next headland. I encourage the Government to reflect on their proposals and grasp the opportunity to consult on this volunteering opportunity. Question put, That the clause be read a Second time.

• 16 Jan 2025 · Employment Rights Bill (Twenty First sitting) · Hansard source

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  I beg to move, That the clause be read a Second time. The new clause relates to volunteering and giving leave to volunteers. It would require a consultation, so I hope that the Government will grasp it with both hands. It feels like their modus operandi on the Bill is for a vast majority of it to go out to further consultation, so what harm would there be in another small consultation on volunteering?

• 16 Jan 2025 · Employment Rights Bill (Twenty First sitting) · Hansard source

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  I beg to move, That the clause be read a Second time. The new clause is an opportunity to extend carer’s leave across the whole of Great Britain. I hope it falls on more fertile ground than the previous new clause. There are 10.6 million carers across the United Kingdom, yet only 2.5 million are actually in paid employment. That shows that, although some of those carers may be beyond or even below working age, there is still a significant untapped pool of opportunity to drive productivity in our economy. The economic growth figures released this morning show that the handbrake is sadly still on in our economy due to the appalling state that the Labour party inherited from the previous Government, so we need to think about how to allow people to work in our economy as strongly as possible. Centrica has found that there is an £8 billion cost to our economy for those who choose to leave the workplace due to having caring commitments. This would potentially allow a goodly number of those to remain in the workplace and continue to contribute. Although this is a probing amendment, I hope the Minister will give it some serious consideration and advise the Committee on what exploration the Government may choose to undertake of this golden opportunity for us as a society.

• 16 Jan 2025 · Employment Rights Bill (Twenty First sitting) · Hansard source

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  I beg to move, That the clause be read a Second time. The new clause would extend statutory adoption pay to those who are self-employed or contractors. I must declare something of an interest, although I do not formally need to, because I am adopted myself, and this issue is extremely close to my heart. When I was leader of the Torbay unitary council, we went from “failing” to “good” for our children’s services within two years. That is probably the biggest achievement of my life. Again, it was something I was driven on because I am adopted. In the ’70s, I was very fortunate to be adopted by Eric and Penny. Eric was not a toolmaker, but he was a lorry driver, and would potentially have benefited had there been an opportunity such as the one I have outlined in the new clause. I encourage colleagues to step back slightly and to reflect on the challenges in social care, and particularly children’s social care, and on the heavy costs—I am sure colleagues are only too aware of them—to local authorities, which have a responsibility for children’s services. For those kids who need support, the best people are foster carers or those who adopt. When there is a lack of such people—when there is not that capacity—kids might have to be picked up by the private sector, and hard-pressed local authorities often have to pay through the nose for that. The new clause is about changing the weather again around support for youngsters in need. By extending statutory adoption pay to those who are self-employed or contractors, we would enhance the pool of those who can participate. I thank my hon. Friend the Member for Hazel Grove (Lisa Smart) for her help with the new clause. Earlier this week, she led a worthwhile debate on this issue, and I acknowledge the positive feedback the Minister in that debate gave on the proposals. I look forward to hearing from this Minister how the Government could take the proposals in this probing amendment forward.

• 16 Jan 2025 · Employment Rights Bill (Twenty First sitting) · Hansard source

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  I thank the Minister for her encouraging words. I beg to ask leave to withdraw the motion. Clause, by leave, withdrawn. New Clause 37 Right to be accompanied “(1) Section 10 of the Employment Relations Act 1999 (right to be accompanied) is amended as follows. (2) In subsection (3), after paragraph (b) insert— ‘(ba) a person who has been reasonably certified in writing by a Professional Body as having experience of, or as having received training in, acting as a worker’s companion at disciplinary or grievance hearings, or’ (3) After subsection (7) insert— ‘(8) In this section, “Professional Body” means any organisation, which is authorised by a regulation made by the Secretary of State pursuant to subsection (9). (9) The Secretary of State may make a regulation or regulations authorising any organisation as a Professional Body for the purposes of this section.’” —(Steve Darling.) This new clause would expand the right to be accompanied by a certified companion at disciplinary and grievance hearings . Brought up, and read the First time.

• 16 Jan 2025 · Employment Rights Bill (Twenty First sitting) · Hansard source

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  Throughout our debates, Conservative colleagues have been critical of the Government for not having an oven-ready Bill and emphasising the need for further consultation. I have sympathy with that, as does my hon. Friend the Member for Chippenham. However, the last Conservative amendment that we will consider in Committee would require consultation, so I wonder whether the Labour party’s proposals have worn the Conservatives down into believing in it. I am delighted by that; perhaps they have changed their minds on the rest of the Bill, too. I hope that the Minister will grasp the opportunity with both hands.

• 15 Jan 2025 · Women’s Changed State Pension Age: Compensation · Hansard source

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  I congratulate the right hon. Member South Holland and the Deepings (Sir John Hayes) on securing this really important debate. When one reflects on there being more WASPI women in the United Kingdom than the population of Wales, it demonstrates how this is a massive issue for this United Kingdom. In my constituency there are 6,930 WASPI women, and there are a similar number in Newton Abbot over the border. There are 7,400 in South Devon. Yet in the Prime Minister’s constituency there are fewer than 4,000. I smell a rat. I will give credit to those Labour Members who are here but, just as with the winter fuel payments, we can see that sadly certain members of the Government are choosing, because of the arithmetic around pensioners, to make decisions of an ill-advised nature like this. In her statement on WASPI women, the Secretary of State talked of the fact that the decision was made by a previous Government, and that that was what WASPI women were really concerned about. The reality is—I hope the Minister will address this; other colleagues have raised it—that the report was about the communications and the impact on women. It was not about a previous decision. So that is what the Government should be addressing.

• 15 Jan 2025 · Women’s Changed State Pension Age: Compensation · Hansard source

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  Yes, and my hon. Friend also reminds me of Marilyn in my constituency, who suffered a significant illness and would have benefited from compensation—as would Pam, who cared for two terminally-ill family members. I totally agree with my hon. Friend. What a baptism of fire this is for the new Minister, but we need him to address the real issues. He must not be wilfully blind to the recommendations of the ombudsman. I would also welcome an explanation why an answer to my named day question, which was named yesterday, remains outstanding.

• 14 Jan 2025 · Employment Rights Bill (Twentieth sitting) · Hansard source

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  I welcome the Minister’s reassurances and I beg to ask leave to withdraw the clause. Clause, by leave, withdrawn. New Clause 12 Substitution Clauses “(1) Any agreement, whether a contract or otherwise, between— (a) an employer or a contractor of services, and (b) an employee, worker or dependent contractor must not include provision for the employee, worker or dependent contractor to appoint a substitute to supply services or undertake work on their behalf. (2) For the purposes of subsection (1)(a), “contractor of services” means an organisation that— (a) enters into an agreement, whether a contract or otherwise, with a supplier or dependent contractor to supply services, (b) does not require the supplier or dependent contractor to supply services, and (c) pays the supplier or dependent contractor according to tasks performed rather than hours of work. (3) For the purposes of subsection (1)(b), "dependent contractor" means an individual who— (a) is appointed to perform work or services for an employer or contractor of services, (b) is paid according to tasks performed rather than hours of work, (c) depends partially or primarily on the employer or contractor of services for employment and income, (d) is not required to perform services for the employer or contractor of services, and (e) is not specified as an employee or worker within a statement of employment particulars or a contract of employment.” —(Nick Timothy.) This new clause would prohibit the use of “substitution clauses”, which allow companies to permit their suppliers – including some delivery couriers – to appoint a substitute to supply services on their behalf. Brought up, and read the First time.

• 14 Jan 2025 · Employment Rights Bill (Twentieth sitting) · Hansard source

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  I beg to move, That the clause be read a Second time.

• 14 Jan 2025 · Employment Rights Bill (Twentieth sitting) · Hansard source

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  I thank the Minister for that reassurance. In the light of that, I beg to ask leave to withdraw the motion. Clause, by leave, withdrawn. New Clause 19 Consultation on trade union legislation “(1) The Secretary of State must initiate a consultation on— (a) the operation of the Trade Union and Labour Relations (Consolidation) Act 1992; and (b) the effects on that operation of provisions contained in Part 4 of this Act. (2) The Secretary of State must lay before each House of Parliament, no sooner than eighteen weeks after the initiation referred to in subsection (1), a report on— (a) the outcome of that consultation, and (b) the Government’s proposals for changes to the legislation referred to in subsection (1).”— (Greg Smith.) This new clause requires the Secretary of State to undertake a consultation on the operation of trade union legislation, and see also Amendment 116. Brought up, and read the First time.

• 14 Jan 2025 · Employment Rights Bill (Twentieth sitting) · Hansard source

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  It is a pleasure to serve under your chairmanship, Ms Vaz. When I became an MP, I never thought that I would be standing before a Committee talking about clause 4. However, this is not about public ownership but is actually about non-disclosure agreements. Non-disclosure agreements were originally about keeping trade secrets but, over recent years, they have proliferated and, sadly, have kept shameful secrets away from the public eye in situations where light needs to be cast to make sure that things are tackled. Sadly, I personally have been signed up to one of these agreements. I reassure the Committee that it was not a business in my constituency, but another one where I suffered a level of discrimination, and I had to sign an NDA. That did not allow me to cry foul on a certain issue that myself and my family suffered. As for the bigger picture of where NDAs have been used at an industrial level, one only has to look at Harrods and the stories that have come up around sexual harassment. Part of the Bill is about trying to tackle harassment and sexual harassment. New clause 4 strengthens the Bill by making sure that NDAs are exempt from this area. As I alluded to with Mohamed al-Fayed, these were used at an industrial level when people were at a very confused stage, and were very vulnerable. I ask the Minister to give serious consideration to incorporating the new clause in our proposals. This is a golden opportunity. We have already seen Ireland take this step. I encourage the Minister to embrace new clause 4.

• 14 Jan 2025 · Employment Rights Bill (Twentieth sitting) · Hansard source

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  I will just share with colleagues that this measure was part of the commitments in the Liberal Democrats’ fully costed manifesto. I thank the Minister for their reassurances. I beg to ask leave to withdraw the motion. Clause, by leave, withdrawn. New Clause 14 Kinship care leave “(1) The Employment Rights Act 1996 is amended as follows. (2) After section 80EE insert— ‘Chapter 5 Kinship care leave 80EF Kinship care leave (1) The Secretary of State must make regulations entitling an employee to be absent from work on leave under this section if the employee satisfies conditions specified in the regulations as to an eligible kinship care arrangement with a child. (2) The regulations must include provision for determining— (a) the extent of an employee’s entitlement to leave under this section in respect of a child; (b) when leave under this section may be taken. (3) Provision under subsection (2)(a) must secure that— (a) where only one employee is entitled to leave under this section in respect of a given child, the employee is entitled to at least 52 weeks’ leave; (b) where more than one employee is entitled to leave under this section in respect of the same child, those employees are entitled to share at least 52 weeks’ leave between them. (4) An employee is entitled to leave under this section only if the eligible kinship care arrangement is intended to last— (a) at least one year, and (b) until the child being cared for attains the age of 18. (5) For the purposes of this Chapter, ‘eligible kinship care arrangement’ means— (a) special guardianship, (b) a kinship child arrangement, (c) a private fostering arrangement, or (d) a private family arrangement, within the meaning given by section (Meaning of ‘kinship care’) of the Employment Rights Act 2024. (6) The regulations may make provision about how leave under this section is to be taken. (7) In this section— (a) “special guardianship”, “kinship child arrangement”, “private fostering arrangement” and “private family arrangement” have the same meanings as in section (Meaning of “kinship care”) of the Employment Rights Act 2024. (b) “week” means any period of seven days. 80EG Rights during and after kinship care leave (1) Regulations under section 80EF must provide— (a) that an employee who is absent on leave under that section is entitled, for such purposes and to such extent as the regulations may prescribe, to the benefit of the terms and conditions of employment which would have applied but for the absence, (b) that an employee who is absent on leave under that section is bound, for such purposes and to such extent as the regulations may prescribe, by obligations arising under those terms and conditions (except in so far as they are inconsistent with subsection (1) of that section), and (c) that an employee who is absent on leave under that section is entitled to return from leave to a job of a kind prescribed by regulations, subject to section 80EH. (2) The reference in subsection (1)(c) to absence on leave under section 80EF includes, where appropriate, a reference to a continuous period of absence attributable partly to leave under that section and partly to any one or more of the following— (a) maternity leave, (b) paternity leave, (c) adoption leave, (d) shared parental leave, (e) parental leave, (f) parental bereavement leave. (3) In subsection (1)(a), “terms and conditions of employment”— (a) includes matters connected with an employee’s employment whether or not they arise under the contract of employment, but (b) does not include terms and conditions about remuneration. (4) Regulations under section 80EF may specify matters which are, or are not, to be treated as remuneration for the purposes of this section. (5) Regulations under section 80EF may make provision, in relation to the right to return mentioned in subsection (1)(c), about— (a) seniority, pension rights and similar rights; (b) terms and conditions of employment on return. 80EH Special cases (1) Regulations under section 80EF may make provision about— (a) redundancy during or after a period of leave under that section, or (b) dismissal (other than by reason of redundancy) during a period of leave under that section. (2) Provision by virtue of subsection (1) may include— (a) provision requiring an employer to offer alternative employment; (b) provision for the consequences of failure to comply with the regulations (which may include provision for a dismissal to be treated as unfair for the purposes of Part 10). 80EI Chapter 5: supplemental (1) Regulations under section 80EF may— (a) make provision about notices to be given, evidence to be produced and other procedures to be followed by employees and employers; (b) make provision requiring employers or employees to keep records; (c) make provision for the consequences of failure to give notices, to produce evidence, to keep records or to comply with other procedural requirements; (d) make provision for the consequences of failure to act in accordance with a notice given by virtue of paragraph (a); (e) make special provision for cases where an employee has a right which corresponds to a right under section 80EF and which arises under the person’s contract of employment or otherwise; (f) make provision modifying the effect of Chapter 2 of Part 14 (calculation of a week’s pay) in relation to an employee who is or has been absent from work on leave under section 80EF; (g) make provision applying, modifying or excluding an enactment, in such circumstances as may be specified and subject to any conditions which may be specified, in relation to a person entitled to take leave under section 80EF; (h) make different provision for different cases or circumstances; (i) make consequential provision. (2) The cases or circumstances mentioned in subsection (1)(h) include— (a) more than one child being subject to the same eligible kinship care arrangement, and (b) a child being subject to an eligible kinship care arrangement on two or more separate occasions, and regulations may, in particular, make special provision regarding the applicability and extent of the entitlement to leave in such circumstances. (3) The Secretary of State may by regulations make provision for some or all of a period of kinship care leave to be paid.’”— (Steve Darling.) This new clause sets out an entitlement to kinship care leave. Brought up, and read the First time.

• 14 Jan 2025 · Employment Rights Bill (Twentieth sitting) · Hansard source

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  I beg to move, That the clause be read a Second time.

• 14 Jan 2025 · Employment Rights Bill (Twentieth sitting) · Hansard source

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  I am sure that my residents would be horrified that these proposals are seeing the light of day in the Committee. I am shocked that Conservative Members are putting them out there. I expected us just to pass on by them, but I want to make sure that it is on the record that the Liberal Democrats do not support these rather peculiar proposals, which have only seen the light of day thanks to a Conservative Member.

• 14 Jan 2025 · Employment Rights Bill (Twentieth sitting) · Hansard source

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  I beg to move, That the clause be read a Second time. I thank my hon. Friend the Member for Twickenham (Munira Wilson) for assisting in tabling the new clause, which is about ensuring that we put the family at the heart of our society by doubling the rates of maternity, paternity, adoption, shared paternity and parental bereavement pay, which are really important when people are on leave. Sadly, a lot of men choose not to take up these opportunities. We will discuss later our proposals on kinship care and fostering, and this is all part of that bigger picture. By supporting families with these four proposals in the three key areas that they cover, we are putting family at the heart of our world. One only has to reflect on social care and children’s social care, and the significant cost where there is family breakdown, to see that the more the state can do to support families, the better. I would like to move on to kinship care, where there are real opportunities. I know that the all-party parliamentary group on kinship care has discussed these measures and sees this as a real opportunity for the Government to move positively to support kinship carers.

• 14 Jan 2025 · Employment Rights Bill (Twentieth sitting) · Hansard source

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  That is fine. As I said, the new clause is about supporting the family, and I hope the Minister will give serious consideration to our proposals. Apologies for misunderstanding, Ms Vaz.

• 14 Jan 2025 · Employment Rights Bill (Twentieth sitting) · Hansard source

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  Apologies, Ms Vaz; I was somewhat premature on the previous item. I pay tribute to my hon. Friend the Member for Twickenham, who has highlighted this matter and proposed this new clause on kinship care. The kinship care APPG discussed this proposal and was mostly in favour of it. The number of children in our United Kingdom who benefit from kinship care is 130,000—equivalent to the population of Colchester or Watford. That is three times more than the number of youngsters who benefit from fostering, which is where one imagines, and one would hope, most youngsters in need of support would get it. The new clause, by allowing additional leave, would allow greater flexibility to get those youngsters into the family, and would help families come to terms with, and settle into, kinship care. There are eye-watering costs in the care system. Some companies are making outrageous profits from family breakdown. I encourage Members to think about how we can reshape society to give more support. As somebody who has adopted myself, adoption and fostering are matters very close to my heart, and I would strongly welcome more opportunities for kinship care. Equally, new clause 45, which would provide for an additional week of unpaid leave for foster carers, is extremely important. We need to change the workplace so that it supports foster families and kinship care families, making sure that, the vast majority of the time, the best place for a child is within a loving family home—whatever shape or form that takes—rather than in a care home or similar place miles away from home. This collection of proposals would help to drive the agenda to change our culture in the UK and support young people in loving homes, with families.

• 14 Jan 2025 · Employment Rights Bill (Nineteeth sitting) · Hansard source

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  It is a pleasure to serve under your chairmanship, Mr Mundell. I welcome the clarity offered by the Government in the amendment.

• 14 Jan 2025 · Employment Rights Bill (Nineteeth sitting) · Hansard source

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  I echo the shadow Minister, who sits to my right—in more ways than one. Definitely, further clarity from the Minister would be welcome.

• 14 Jan 2025 · Adoptive Parents: Financial Support · Hansard source

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  It is a pleasure to serve under your chairwomanship, Ms Furniss. I congratulate my hon. Friend the Member for Hazel Grove (Lisa Smart) on securing this really important debate. I highlight to the Minister the adoption support fund; I would be grateful if he could talk about any long-term plans the Government may have to bake that into Government proposals, because currently it is a hand-to-mouth existence. A week after I got elected, a resident raised with me their concerns. I wrote to the Minister on this issue some months ago, but I wonder whether the Government’s thoughts on the matter have changed. I speak as somebody who was myself adopted into a very loving family in the 1970s, with Eric and Penny. Eric was self-employed. He was not a toolmaker; he was a lorry driver—a haulage contractor if we were trying to be social climbers. The reality is that it was a really loving family. Of course, as a self-employed haulage contractor, Eric would have benefited from the proposals we heard about from my hon. Friend the Member for Hazel Grove. The world of adoption and fostering has changed massively. The babe in arms is often not what one gets through adoption or fostering, but children who have had complex, challenging lives and will try to test parents. I have a good friend in Torquay whose child tests him regularly. The child believes that daddy is a monster because his previous daddy was, sadly, a monster to him. It is really challenging for that adoptive family to face that. I also welcome the comments about Home for Good, which is a service that I brought in to Torbay when I was leader of the local authority. It looks at driving adoption through those with faith and using churches to support those with faith. There is a significant need out there. Even for purely cynical reasons, I encourage the Minister to reflect on how important it is to support self-employed people so that we enhance the pool, as one only needs to look at the cost of social care to councils up and down the country when a foster placement or adoption—as quite often fostering does turn into adoption—cannot be found. The private sector is sadly making significant profits from that. Although I am pleased that the Government are making progress in those areas, the best way to make progress is to look at places such as Leeds, which I visited once upon a time, and now also Torbay, becoming UNICEF child friendly communities. That will drive a positive culture of engagement and support for our young people throughout the United Kingdom. I hope that the Minister will look kindly on the proposals from my hon. Friend the Member for Hazel Grove.