Chris Bryant MP: speeches 2025

Speeches

• 7 Mar 2025 · Protection of Children (Digital Safety and Data Protection) Bill · Hansard source

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  I just thought my hon. Friend might like know that I will not be making any of the arguments that he is arguing I should not argue.

• 7 Mar 2025 · Protection of Children (Digital Safety and Data Protection) Bill · Hansard source

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  I bet this is not a point of order.

• 7 Mar 2025 · Protection of Children (Digital Safety and Data Protection) Bill · Hansard source

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  Division!

• 7 Mar 2025 · Protection of Children (Digital Safety and Data Protection) Bill · Hansard source

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  My hon. Friend makes an extremely good point. The use of a mobile phone as another form of aggression is a very disturbing part of the trend we have seen. She is quite right that we need to consider action in that field. The hon. Member for Esher and Walton referred to services that are “inherently addictive by design”. I think there is actually a contradiction in terms there. They are not inherently addictive; they are addictive by design. Those are two quite different things. We should strive to achieve no services provided for children being addictive by design, which is precisely one of the things that the Government are determined about. I should say to the right hon. Member for North West Hampshire (Kit Malthouse) that I indicated earlier that I had had no meetings with tech by making a zero with my fingers, but that is not quite true. I had a meeting a few months ago with Baroness Jones and TikTok, although I expressed as strongly as many Members have in this debate the kind of views that they have in relation to the operation of TikTok. It is not that I have been convinced by TikTok—if anything, we were trying to put the argument to it about the need for responsible activity in this field.

• 7 Mar 2025 · Protection of Children (Digital Safety and Data Protection) Bill · Hansard source

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  I think it was John Prescott who said something about ancient values in a modern setting. As we move forward, we need to secure the liberty of the individual at the same time as we protect the vulnerable. My hon. Friend the Member for Leeds North West (Katie White) made the point that she has had twice as much correspondence on this subject as on any other this year. She made a really important point, which applies not only to this area, but to many other areas in which we work with young people: if we possibly can, it is very important to be able to extend the years of childhood that a child gets to enjoy. Many years ago, I wrote a report about teenage pregnancy in my constituency. That is another aspect of trying to ensure that where children delay their first sexual experience, it is almost certainly better for them and leads to better personal, social and other outcomes. My hon. Friend the Member for Derbyshire Dales (John Whitby) made a point about children attending A&E with psychiatric conditions. I urge him to be slightly cautious about the statistics here, because the work that I have done on acquired brain injuries suggests that sometimes people are actually presenting with a brain injury, rather than a psychiatric condition. That is one of the areas where we need to be much more intelligent about how we get data that informs our research. We heard from the hon. Member for Esher and Walton (Monica Harding)—incidentally, I see “Esher and Walton” written down and think, “That must be a Conservative Member of Parliament,” so it is such a delight when I find that it is not.

• 7 Mar 2025 · Protection of Children (Digital Safety and Data Protection) Bill · Hansard source

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  I urge the right hon. Gentleman to be slightly less sceptical about the value of CMO advice. As he knows, I have campaigned for many years on acquired brain injury, particularly in relation to concussion or sub-concussive events in sport. It was a very significant change when, under the previous Administration, the British Government brought forward specific advice in relation to concussion in sport. That has changed practices in lots of sports around the country, and I am hopeful that authoritative advice of this kind could make a significant difference.

• 7 Mar 2025 · Protection of Children (Digital Safety and Data Protection) Bill · Hansard source

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  I am afraid you will have to put up with me, Madam Deputy Speaker. My hon. Friend the Member for Darlington (Lola McEvoy) referred to the fear of missing out, which is such a potent aspect of many young people’s lives. It had its previous version before digital arrived, but it is so much more acute now, and it cuts in so many different ways at the same time. She also referred to Ellen Roome and the issues in the Data (Use and Access) Bill, which we will discuss in the Public Bill Committee next Tuesday and Thursday, and then on Report in a few weeks’ time. I look forward to her contributions. My hon. Friend the Member for North West Cambridgeshire (Sam Carling), with whom I cannot compete for youth, made a very important point: one of the positive effects that social media can introduce, and which was not available to me when I was trying to work out, at the age of 15 or 16, whether I was gay, is that there is a diaspora—there are other worlds where there are people a bit more like me. That is a release for many young people, so being able to harness what is good in social media, and to lose what is bad, is the key task for us. Nothing could matter more than the mental, physical and spiritual health of our young people. There are many aspects to that health, including addiction to alcohol, drugs, gambling and, I would argue, as many others have done today, smartphone use. Harmful messages about body image, violent and risky sex, radicalisation, bullying, self-confidence and taking one’s own life are all part of that. Physical health is, of course, part of mental and spiritual health. As many Members have mentioned, getting out and about, eye-to-eye contact and brain development all matter. Let us be absolutely clear: excessive smartphone use is engaged in all aspects of mental, spiritual and, I would argue, physical ill health. Algorithms can be set to increase addictive scrolling. Apps with weak age verification processes expose children to completely inappropriate material. The business model for some tech companies is not always conducive to children’s health. We also have to consider the benefits of limited, rather than excessive, use of smartphones. A lot of modern life is accessed online, including homework. Social media can gather diaspora, but that too can be a minefield. If hon. Members have not seen “Under the Volcano”, which is a Polish film about a Ukrainian family stuck in Tenerife at the point of Putin’s second invasion of Ukraine three years ago, they should watch it, because the children in the film are absolutely terrified of what social media is going to tell them about what is happening back at home. I am also conscious that for some neurodiverse youngsters, social media is an absolutely vital means of ensuring their health. We fully recognise the difficulties facing parents, teachers and youth workers in adjudicating rows, as has often been referred to. Teachers know that they are part of a child’s life for only 20% of their time, so the social expectations on parents are just as important as anything else. I fully recognise the complaint that I hear regularly from young people in my constituency: “There’s nothing else to do around here.” A hundred years ago, in every one of our constituencies, there would have been youth clubs, Scouts and Guides, and lots of different organisations that specifically catered for young people to do active things outside the home. Many of those things barely exist today, and that is part of what we need to look at. Let me talk specifically about what we will do and what we are doing. I wish that the Online Safety Act 2023 had been introduced in 2020, 2021 or 2022, because it was far too delayed. It is extremely frustrating for Ministers that it has taken so long to get to this point. We are working with Ofcom to implement every element of the Act as fast as we can, but some elements are written into the Act itself. The Secretary of State wrote to Ofcom on 16 October last year to say that we want to implement everything as fast as we can, while taking on board the criticisms that some people have made of Ofcom. The illegal content codes have now passed parliamentary scrutiny and will come into force this month; I hope that will produce some change. The draft children’s safety codes which have been referred to are nearly finalised. The child safety regime will be in effect by the summer, which is good news, and the Online Safety Act itself, in section 178, says that it must be reviewed. The Department for Science, Innovation and Technology has launched its own feasibility study of the impact of smartphones and social media use, which will report in May. It is being run by the University of Cambridge and a consortium of experts. We hope that the Bill will help us to build on that feasibility study, so that we have the information that we need to take a considered view. We will work to roughly the same timetable as the one for which the Bill provides. The closer we can get to a causal and direct relationship between smartphone use and mental health issues, and to clear evidence of the best, most effective, and most appropriate and proportionate intervention by the Government, the better. We are introducing further measures in the Data (Use and Access) Bill. Under clauses 91, 124 and 81, new requirements for the design of processing activities by information society services likely to be accessed by children, so that they can be protected and supported, will make a significant difference. The Bill’s recommendations chime very much with what we intend to do, and are helpful in that direction. Of course we want the Online Safety Act to bed in; of course we want to implement the data Bill and those new provisions; of course we want to conduct fuller, more authoritative research and provide clear advice for teachers and parents across the land; and of course this is not the end of the matter. I shall be amazed if there is not further legislation in this area in the coming years. I commend the campaigners who have made such a strong case to us, via my hon. Friend the Member for Whitehaven and Workington. The words of the paediatrician mentioned by my hon. Friend the Member for Kensington and Bayswater (Joe Powell) are ringing in my mind. There is no option of inaction for this House or this country. There has to be action, and I am grateful to my hon. Friend the Member for Whitehaven and Workington for introducing the Bill today. Ordered, That the debate be now adjourned.— ( Jeff Smith .) Debate to be resumed on Friday 11 July.

• 7 Mar 2025 · Protection of Children (Digital Safety and Data Protection) Bill · Hansard source

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  The right hon. Gentleman is beginning to subscribe to conspiracy theories. I have had no role in any negotiations with my hon. Friend the Member for Whitehaven and Workington or with Downing Street on these matters, and I have not taken into consideration anything in relation to what Donald Trump might think about this field. My hon. Friend the Member for Chipping Barnet (Dan Tomlinson) said that he is 32, which is obviously very difficult to believe. He referred to smartphones in 2007, but 3G was launched in 2001. I am slightly conscious that when I was at school, the only thing we were rowing about was whether we were allowed to take electronic calculators into O-level maths exams, so I sometimes feel a little out of my depth with all these young expressions of interest.

• 7 Mar 2025 · Protection of Children (Digital Safety and Data Protection) Bill · Hansard source

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  I have seen an awful lot of Bills in my time, since 2001, and nearly every one has contained something that did not actually need to be in legislation but that, none the less, was put in as a declaratory statement by the House. When a Bill has big support, it tends to be something that effects change. That might very well be the same effect that we have today.

• 7 Mar 2025 · Protection of Children (Digital Safety and Data Protection) Bill · Hansard source

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  That is exactly what the Government will do.

• 7 Mar 2025 · Protection of Children (Digital Safety and Data Protection) Bill · Hansard source

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  I will run through some of the contributions to the debate and then give specific answers to some of the points that have been made. First, I will probably have the unanimous support of the House in praising my hon. Friend the Member for Whitehaven and Workington (Josh MacAlister). [Hon. Members: “Hear, hear.”] I am slightly worried that he was referred to as a patron saint earlier, because the danger with patron saints is that they tend to be martyred at some point in their career, and I do not wish that for him. As I said earlier, I am not going to make any of the arguments that he told me not to make, because I do not subscribe to them. I am also not going to make any arguments today against action—that is an important point that the House needs to recognise. Everybody accepts that action in this sphere is inevitable. My hon. Friend the Member for Dulwich and West Norwood (Helen Hayes) gave us some shocking statistics from her constituency, as have many other Members. The hon. Member for Reigate (Rebecca Paul), who is no longer in her place— [ Interruption. ] Oh, she is here; sorry, I would not want to mislead the House. She fessed up to her own social media use, but she did not tell us how many hours a day it is, so we were watching her throughout the debate to see how much time she was spending on social media. It is absolutely true that many of us are just as addicted as many young people, and while our specific concern is about the effects on the mental health of children, there are of course issues for the whole of society. Other Members have referred to misinformation and how it is propagated, and how to access good, reliable information in a world that is profoundly chaotic, where algorithms do not necessarily subscribe to truth in the way that previous understandings of the media used to. I note that the hon. Member for Reigate said that the state must step in—we will hold her to that on many more occasions in future. My hon. Friend the Member for Lowestoft (Jess Asato) made some very important points, including that it is sometimes the most vulnerable children who experience these effects. She also pointed—as did several other Members—to the desensitising effect on boys, in particular, who see versions of sex online that normalise a set of expectations about what a relationship with another person might be and what sex might involve that are wholly alien to most people’s understanding of what they should be. My hon. Friend the Member for Beckenham and Penge (Liam Conlon) made a point that was also made in a previous Westminster Hall debate on this issue: does the burden of proof lie with those trying to prove that there is no harm, or with those trying to prove that there is harm? It is important that we look at the evidence in the round and come to a coherent, sensible, one-Government decision on how we can make progress in this field.

• 7 Mar 2025 · Protection of Children (Digital Safety and Data Protection) Bill · Hansard source

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  You’re not old enough.

• 4 Mar 2025 · Data (Use and Access) Bill [ Lords ] (Second sitting) · Hansard source

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  Sorry, the hon. Member will have to repeat that question. I did not hear it, I am afraid.

• 4 Mar 2025 · Data (Use and Access) Bill [ Lords ] (Second sitting) · Hansard source

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  On behalf of everyone in the nation. Well, Thames Water does not cover the whole nation, although it gets quite a lot of water from Wales, which we are very happy to provide. The hon. Member made a good point, and yes, this is part of holding all those with underground assets to account. That is the practical aspect of it. My hon. Friend the Member for Dudley mentioned digging for infrastructure projects. Much of the infrastructure that we once thought of as a “nice to have” is now critical to people’s lives, particularly broadband connectivity. A local hospital or GP clinic simply could not survive without a broadband connection as it would not be able to look at X-rays or run off the labels for blood tests, and so on. Everything is so intrinsically connected, so it is important that we get this secured. Question put and agreed to. Clause 56, as amended, accordingly ordered to stand part of the Bill . Schedule 1 agreed to. Clause 57 ordered to stand part of the Bill . Clause 58 National Underground Asset Register: Northern Ireland

• 4 Mar 2025 · Data (Use and Access) Bill [ Lords ] (Second sitting) · Hansard source

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  I was under the impression that all the clauses in this part were grouped. It might be convenient for the Committee if they were.

• 4 Mar 2025 · Data (Use and Access) Bill [ Lords ] (Second sitting) · Hansard source

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  As I was saying, clause 63 inserts proposed new section 38B of the Births and Deaths Registration Act 1953, which enables the Minister to make regulations in relation to duties under the Act to sign the births or deaths register where electronic registers are kept. Regulations under that power will specify the requirements that an informant will need to comply with when registering a birth, stillbirth or death. A person who complies with the requirements is to be treated as having signed the register and to have done so in the presence of the registrar. The removal of the requirement for an informant to attend at the register office to sign the register in the presence of the registrar allows us to transform how births and deaths are registered in future. Regulations made by the Minister under proposed new section 38B will be subject to the affirmative procedure. Clause 64 covers the treatment of the existing registers of births, stillbirths and deaths. Every superintendent registrar is required to continue to keep any registers of live births or deaths in their custody immediately before the repeal of section 28 of the Births and Deaths Registration Act comes into force with the records of the office. Any unfilled registers of stillbirths will be deposited with the Registrar General for keeping at the General Register Office. The clause also specifies how copies of birth and death records that are being held in an electronic format are to be treated following commencement. Where a copy of a register of births or deaths was also kept electronically during the time beginning on 1 July 2009 and ending immediately before the day that clause 61 comes into force, the register is to be treated as kept in electronic form and signatures within it will continue to be effective for the purpose of the Act. Clause 65 introduces schedule 3, which contains minor and consequential amendments to the Births and Deaths Registration Act and the Registration Service Act, and minor amendments to other Acts, as a consequence of the move from paper registers to the registration of births and deaths in an electronic register. All those provisions were, of course, in previous iterations of the Bill.

• 4 Mar 2025 · Data (Use and Access) Bill [ Lords ] (Second sitting) · Hansard source

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  No, because we think that the desire is inappropriate. Why would the Government want to reveal cyber-security measures to third parties? It seems incorrect to require the Government to provide that information. I am not aware of any other Bill—perhaps the shadow Minister can think of one—that would require the Government to provide information on cyber-security measures to third parties.

• 4 Mar 2025 · Data (Use and Access) Bill [ Lords ] (Second sitting) · Hansard source

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  Well, it is certainly a vulnerability. I started the restoration and renewal process when I was Deputy Leader of the House many years ago. Many people told me that one of the problems in Parliament was the danger of fire, which is certainly the case. We have done some work to make sure the risers cannot take fire from one part of the building to another very rapidly. However, I have always said that just as problematic is everything underneath the building, including both the sewers and the pipework that carries the telecommunications networks. Parliament simply could not work if there were any kind of critical breach. Several hon. Members raised that point, and my hon. Friend the Member for Norwich North said it is extraordinary that such a register does not already exist—she is absolutely right. That is no particular criticism of the previous Government; they tried for some time to get this going. I wish it had happened five, six or seven years ago, because we would be in a much better place today. Several Members have asked when we will see the economic benefits. There are dramatic benefits for contractors if they have a swifter process, because they will know precisely what they are digging up and why. I also have responsibility for the telecoms brief in Government, and one of the major problems I have—I fear this might elicit comments from colleagues—is the issue of ducts and poles. When rolling out gigabit-capable broadband, we have encouraged operators and undertakers should share ducts wherever possible. However, in many places we simply do not know whether there is an available duct, whether the duct already has a full sleeve—because it has all the cabling that could possibly fit—or, frankly, whether it is just a buried cable. If we kept that kind of information more reliably, we would be able to make much better decisions. Operators would be able to make better investment decisions about where to go fastest and how to share ducts and poles. It would be beneficial for people who would not have to see their road repeatedly dug up by different operators providing, in essence, the same service. That is bound to be of financial significance. My hon. Friend the Member for Uxbridge and South Ruislip spoke about the advantages of having a national system, and he is absolutely right. There is no point in having different systems around the country; we need a single national system, not least because much of the pipework and cabling does not follow the boundaries of local authorities or parliamentary constituencies, however they may be constructed at any particular time. That goes to the point made by my hon. Friend the Member for Norwich North about the changing devolution settlement in particular areas. That is a matter for another Department, but it is why it is so important to have a national system rather than individual systems. Several colleagues asked whether local authorities will have to pay fees. A local authority would have to pay only if it were a contractor. The whole point of the clause is that the undertakers will pay for the NUAR. My hon. Friend the Member for Smethwick gave us a classic example of the kind of issue we want to resolve in these situations. He is a relatively new MP, but I have done more than 20 years of dealing with these issues. It is the bane of an MP’s life, because MPs have relatively few levers to pull. Councillors have more responsibilities and often more levers to bring about change, although just occasionally a letter containing the letters “MP” and a portcullis still impresses some contractors and changes their view. My hon. Friend is absolutely right that this will help to improve the delivery of public services and help us to grow the economy. The hon. Member for Harpenden and Berkhamsted made a constituency point.

• 4 Mar 2025 · Data (Use and Access) Bill [ Lords ] (Second sitting) · Hansard source

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  These amendments broadly seek to do the same thing. As has been said, an estimated 4 million km of pipes and cables are buried underground across the UK. A hole is dug every seven seconds to install, fix and maintain the apparatus that is critical to keeping our water running, our gas and electricity flowing and our communications with the outside world connected. The provisions governing access to information kept in the NUAR are established by clause 56 for England and Wales, and by clause 58 for Northern Ireland. Those clauses respectively insert section 106C into the New Roads and Street Works Act 1991, and 45C into the Street Works (Northern Ireland) Order 1995. The amendments would particularly affect the NUAR’s operation in Northern Ireland. It should be noted that the equivalent provision to that made by clause 58 is also made for England and Wales by clause 56, which we have already agreed. Only amending clause 58 in this way would lead to inconsistencies in how the NUAR operates. The provisions enabling access to NUAR information have been carefully designed to allow such access to be secure. On amendment 17, the existing provision set out in clause 58(3), to insert article 45C(2)(c) into the 1995 Order, and the equivalent provision in clause 56(1) to insert section 106C(2)(c) into the 1991 Act, are essential to allow the Secretary of State to establish which exceptions should apply to the sharing of NUAR data with end users of the service. That could, for example, enable the Secretary of State to exempt or otherwise restrict the sharing of data for controlled sites, which is critical for ensuring that sensitive information regarding these sites is not made available for wider access. I think we need to retain that power. Removing that provision, as the hon. Member for North Norfolk advocates, would mean the NUAR is unable to share information on apparatus without posing a risk to critical national infrastructure. That would limit the platform’s ability to share information securely, therefore risking the NUAR’s operations and the estimated £400 million of benefits per year. On amendments 18 to 20, there has been significant interest in leveraging the NUAR, as the hon. Member effectively suggested, as a national data asset to deliver additional use cases beyond excavations. More than 200 individuals from nearly 150 different organisations across the public and private sectors have identified over 100 potential use cases for NUAR information. Some of those would require aggregated data across a large space, while some would require detailed data for closely defined locations. For some of those use cases, the information can be provided free at the point of use, while some would impact on existing markets, and as such, careful consideration of how fees are collected and distributed will be required. Accepting amendments 18 to 20 would mean that information held in the NUAR is unable to be used to deliver these additional use cases, therefore limiting the NUAR’s ability to deliver additional benefits and drive growth and innovation across the public and private sectors. The amendment therefore would not put me in the Chancellor’s good books, as the hon. Member suggested. It is important to note that research and development is still being undertaken to assess which, if any, of the potential additional use cases may be taken forward. We envisage that such opportunities would only be taken forward where they are proved to have significant economic and/or social value, taking into consideration the views of stakeholders, including owners of underground apparatus and security stakeholders. I reassure the Committee that given the complexity and sensitivity of access to information held in the NUAR, these provisions have been drafted under the affirmative procedure. This will provide the appropriate level of scrutiny, unlike the negative procedure, which would mean the measures effectively pass without Parliament having an effective say. With those explanations, and noting the risk that the amendments would pose for information security and the NUAR’s ability to drive economic growth, I hope the hon. Member for North Norfolk is content to withdraw amendment 17.

• 4 Mar 2025 · Data (Use and Access) Bill [ Lords ] (Second sitting) · Hansard source

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  I do not need to speak at great length about clause 58, because we already know that it is all about Northern Ireland and it is not being amended. Schedule 2 makes the equivalent provisions for Northern Ireland as schedule 1 does for England and Wales. Again, I do not need to repeat all those arguments. Clause 59 updates the Street Works (Northern Ireland) Order 1995. It makes the equivalent provisions for Northern Ireland as clause 57 does for England and Wales. I hope that those are adequate explanations and I commend the clauses and the schedule to the Committee. Question put and agreed to. Clause 58 accordingly ordered to stand part of the Bill. Schedule 2 agreed to. Clause 59 ordered to stand part of the Bill. Clause 60 Pre-commencement consultation Question proposed, That the clause stand part of the Bill.

• 4 Mar 2025 · Data (Use and Access) Bill [ Lords ] (Second sitting) · Hansard source

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  I will respond first to the contribution from my hon. Friend the Member for Uxbridge and South Ruislip. Several colleagues have referred to the issue of accidental asset strikes, which is a really important part of why we need to do this piece of work. There was a time when a burst drain or burst pipe was significant but was not necessarily a matter of life and death. Nowadays, a major breakage to the broadband service in a local area could mean that all the telecare devices in the area do not work, so people will have no ability to protect themselves or ring for help, which could go on for several days. In some cases, it is quite literally a matter of life and death. Anybody who has been a local councillor knows that these issues plague local government endlessly, which is why it is particularly important. As I referred to earlier, I used to be a priest in the Church of England. I will not name it, but there is a very large graveyard in the north of England that used to be managed by a particular sexton who had a rather casual attitude towards his underground register. He rarely bothered to dig a grave that was six feet deep; he thought that four feet was perfectly sufficient. Because he knew most of the people who ended up being buried in the graveyard, he often judged whether they needed a six-foot hole or whatever it may be. Quite often, that meant that the coffin did not fit. That was not so much of a problem, because we could sort it out on the day. The real problem was when we had to find a space for a new grave. Not every grave is marked by a gravestone, so without a proper register of where all the existing graves were, we had real problems when we started to dig up holes and found ourselves suddenly collapsing in on coffins that were not six feet under. That set of problems is writ large across the whole underground asset register of the United Kingdom. I do not know whether Members have ever been to the torpedo room here in Parliament—everybody is looking blankly at me, so I guess they have not. It contains an enormous spherical metal object that basically takes all the sewage from inside Parliament and spits it every 20 seconds into the main town drain, which is higher than the drain that comes out of Parliament. It is one of our complete vulnerabilities in the Palace of Westminster. If that were to stop working—it has been there since something like 1877—we would be vacating Parliament for a considerable period. I have alerted the shadow Minister, who wants to talk about the torpedo room.

• 4 Mar 2025 · Data (Use and Access) Bill [ Lords ] (Second sitting) · Hansard source

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  I don’t think so!

• 4 Mar 2025 · Data (Use and Access) Bill [ Lords ] (Second sitting) · Hansard source

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  I am grateful to the shadow Minister for agreeing with the legislation that was in the previous Government’s Bill—he is absolutely right that we should have been doing some of this stuff a very long time ago. It strikes me too that one of the MPs for Doncaster said to me the other day that the hospital in Doncaster still has 42 people who are solely employed in carrying physical medical records around. That is just utter madness in a modern-day NHS. How on earth can we possibly be able to transfer data, or have access to blood tests and all the rest, if it is not digitally available?

• 4 Mar 2025 · Data (Use and Access) Bill [ Lords ] (Second sitting) · Hansard source

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  I will respond to hon. Members’ comments and then we can have a more general debate, although I will not repeat my earlier comments about the clause. First, the previous version of the clause, in the previous version of the Bill, did not include a provision like the one inserted by Lords Members. It is extremely unusual for a Bill to include requirements for the Government to refer to security measures and provide information about them to third parties. That is why we are very hesitant. Secondly, the hon. Member for North Norfolk is absolutely right that there is an ambiguity and that the provision could be read in many different ways. That means, of course, that it could be justiciable in many different directions. That leaves the Government in a difficult place, which is one of the reasons why we are uncomfortable. Thirdly, the subsection states: “The Secretary of State must provide guidance to relevant stakeholders on cyber-security measures before they may receive information from NUAR.” I presume that “they” refers to the stakeholders rather than the Government, but why should it be “before”? None of it makes any logical sense to the Government, which is why we want to remove the subsection.

• 4 Mar 2025 · Data (Use and Access) Bill [ Lords ] (Second sitting) · Hansard source

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  In essence, the clause requires a consultation to be undertaken before or after the Bill is passed. It will help the Department to understand stakeholders’ needs and requirements, ensuring their support and the sustainability of NUAR as a service.